posted 09-27-2008 12:54 PM            

So you are saying it needs to be used to justify its creation and existence?

The main issue I have with the APA forum is that its ONLY for APA members, which goes against the 'inclusive vs exclusive' theme Mike spoke of in his speech at APA.

Are they giving any consideration for entry to those who are legitimate examiners but aren't members of APA?

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Ralph Hilliard
PolygraphPlace Owner & Operator

Be sure to visit our new store for all things Polygraph Related
http://store.polygraphplace.com

posted 09-27-2008 05:15 PM            

Are the forums going to be open to science and technology members and their employees and/or honorary members or will it be examiners only?

On the other hand the inclusive nature of this board makes it a more desirable place to discuss general polygraph examiner issues.

I also can't help but wonder if APA is prepared for the kind of gloves-off discussion that pops up here from time to time.

I really don't understand why the APA wants or needs its own forum for general polygraph examiner issues. Any member examiner would certainly be eligible for admission here and considering the reputation of this forum as THE place for polygraph discussion as well as an attached public forum for information why don't they just come on over here. They could certainly open a thread on any subject they consider important. Besides who in the world are they going to find willing to put in the time and effort that our moderators donate on a regular basis.

Better yet if they wanted a section over here for APA members only, they could ask for one and offer to offset costs associated with setting it up and maintaining it.

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Ex scientia veritas

posted 09-29-2008 10:48 AM            

Its great the APA has a forum.

I predict it will be mostly announcements.

One of the things that makes this forum work, in my view, is its independence. Restricted access to polygraph professionals is also important. However, the sense of professional exposure would be very different in a forum hosted by a professional association to which we are in some way accountable. Certainly, the forum membership are accountable here - but its a little more like Vegas this way (it stays here). In practical terms that means more gloves-off conversation, and more tomfoolery. Both are healthy activities. Both contribute to our learning and professional rapport, and both contribute to relationship building.

An APA hosted forum would automatically impose a greater sense of caution and restricted activity, because we are accountable to the APA for our activities both in and out of the forum.

In an independent forum, we are accountable only for our activities within the forum. The APA still holds oversight for professional activities out of the forum, but actitivty in the forum is less vulnerable, and therefore more interesting, more human, and more productive.

The ethical purpose for this forum is to provide contact, comaradarie, and information among polygraph professionals. The ethical purpose for an APA hosted forum cannot be separated from the goals of the APA - to provide ethical standards and oversight to the profesional activities of those who work in the polygraph profession.

Then, you complicate the whole mess with the inevitable mimetics of what it means to be a large international professional association (read: the boundaries become potentially increasingly blurred or increasingly distinct between the mission and purpose for the profession and the mission and purpose of the professional association). Professional associations take on a life of their own, with personalities, politics, and survival agendas.

One of the ways we ensure stability is to actively discourage conflicts of interest. In other professions, this has meant the complete separation of ethical roles. One entity creates standards for qualifications and practice, and another entity reviews the qualifications of each professional. Then, a third entity, typically a state licensing authority is responsible for enforcement.

The ethical threshold of concern is not "conflict of interest" but "possible conflict of interest."

I like the independent forum. People will be afraid to show their arse in a non-independent forum.

.02

r

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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here. This is the war room."
--(Stanley Kubrick/Peter Sellers - Dr. Strangelove, 1964)

posted 09-29-2008 11:10 AM         

I agree. AAPP launched a web site a few years ago that is quite impressive. The members only forum is a ghost town.

The members only forum at Polygraph Place is the most active of any of the sites and I think it will stay that way.

Here, we can take off the gloves, call it as we see it, make total arses out of ourselves and then nuke the whole mess with a single key stroke!

I have tried posting queswtions on other sites but waiting for a response is kind of like being a customer at Home Depot!

By the way Ray, thanks to the 700 billion bailout, your 2 cents worth now has a net value of 1.2 cents.